First of all in the last 6 to 8 meetings of drury and missouri state missouti state has won 7 of them with domination drury is not a good team and you cant compare them to anyone in div 1 even if it is AA to a div 2 team even if they are "national champs"... so get your facts straight. and also missouri state in 2008 was conference champions in the sunbelt which is a 10 team super conference with a ton of great teams and a lot of talented guys and second in 09 to denver with guys like blake wrosley tearing it up at NCAAs. There are extremely talented swimmers on missouri states team including 2 guys who almost make NCAAs this year and missed by a few spots....long story short the div 2 national champs would be destoryed in a conference like the sunbelt....dont get me wrong there are some fast swimmers on div 2 team but the gap between div 1 AA and Div 2 is a massive one dont kid urself
moral of the story is do some research, get your facts straight, and dont dog or play down team you know nothing about....thanks have a great day!
Maurer might get to go and compete at division II nationals, but let's face the facts. Division II is not competitive at all. There is just so much more at division III even. That's why drury dominates all of the time. There are hardly any teams to compete against. Don't get me wrong, they're a really gifted program for d II, but that's for d II. In their duel early this year against missouri state they got smoked. Missouri state is just a mid D I school also. If they had to swim a big team I couldn't even imagine the results. I just would of rather seen matt go D I because he definitly could of. Now he's apart of the best D II school in the country, but a big thing that helps you become a better swimmer is compitition and you just don't get that in D II. I think why a lot of people from missouri thinks D II is a lot faster then it actually is is because they are so used to hearing about how dominate drury is. I mean, just look at some other schools they compete against. No wonder they're so dominate.
Also, if you look at their 100 free record I believe it's like a 44.3 or something. I could be wrong though. But based off of that, matt split a 44.6. Add at most a half a second to that matts already less than a second off that record. That doesn't seem like that much time to drop over the next couple of years and so I just don't see it being as motivating as a 43 low would be at a bigger school. I just think he would have a better career if he was motivated more, but maybe he just wants to swim at a smaller, D II school dominating program and a lot of swimmers choose to do that and that's cool with me. As long as he enjoys where he's at that's what's most important
Drury a joke? maybe you should take time to look up some results instead of running your mouth... Check out drury swimmers follow them from their freshman to senior year and their improvements and then compare to any div 1 school. Hmmm maybe those coaches do know what they are doing. I know 8 year olds who have been swimming as long as he has. Maybe you should change your font color to GREEN cause thats how it appears. Or maybe you just need to say your part of div 1 school to feel like your good enough. While you might make a ncaa B cut or if your really lucky an A relay maurer will be a real competitor at nationals. Whatever floats your boat..
The springfield boys might have a few good swimmers but who cares, a few wont get you anywhere, you need to have depth when it comes to year around programs to make it to the top. KCB and CSP have depth and will start strong while finishing strong. 3 to 4 good swimmers will get you no where as a team, unless you finally are able to become a team with many good swimmers placeing high.
if you want to see a choke look at the st louis swimmers at state... Springfield and KC will be just as well represented later in the club season as they were at state i bet.
I really had nothing but respect for the Columbia guys. What is up? When have SPA guys choked at sectionals? Do you mean like how Hodges had 2 incredible swims and Sheehan backed up his 200 & 500 from last year? Hendrix did well. Is that the type of choke you are talking about? Or are you talking about the 400 free relay you guys had - the one that was seeded 6th but got 13th. How many better times did you guys have in finals? If I am looking at the results correctly I think it is 0. Is that the type of choke you are talking about? How many better swims did the SPA guys have? Me and my boys don't choke. Thanks for the extra motivation and the target you just put on your back. Hope your CSP boys can back it up better than they did at State.
Come on!!! The springfield Swimmers are all trash. They will choke at sectionals! It is just a proven fact. KCB and CSP will Dominate like always. just give up talkin about SPA
Trenton O'Dell - a club swimmer? when? It will be scary to see what he can do next year in a college program when he really swims all year long.
As far as Maurer, Brinck & Lloyd at trials. Yeah - it will happen. Drury has experience getting kids there. Is Drury mainly responsible for getting Maurer, Brinck and McFall and Lloyd to where they are - yes. That is also why Drury is the program it is and wins Nationals every year. And is probably a top 25 program in the US - no matter D - I, II or III.
oh Dury will get him there no doubt in my mind. Dury is an amazing school with amazing talent. Maurer will have great competition at a D2 school than you could imagine. Its amazing how could maurer really could be after swimming 4 years at dury.
Hey PUTNPLACE...Trenton O'Dell is a SPA swimmer, but only 1 or 2 practices a week during the club season. He doesn't swim any of the club events...just High School. Obviously, he's extremely gifted to finish Top 6 in two individual events this year without being a year-round swimmer. He's a great kid too.
I love all this debate about who's faster, who has better coaches, which city has better swimmers, etc... The good news is that we are talking about swimming where the clock never lies...so the story is to be continued!!!AND...I'll go on record saying that SPA will put up crazy fast times at Sectionals in the Spring. I'll also go on record saying that Maurer is at the Olympic trials in 2012 and will be competitive at those trials. Brinck and Lloyd will probably be there too.
people from springfield being trash? look at how many fast swimmers we from there? they put up a show along with kc at state. The LZR's dont make them cheaters? look at the olympics or some bigger meets, how many people had LZR's there? are they all cheaters? It is all in the training and the motivation to do well, the time drops and results by the end of the meet all came from work i am sure. Suits dont make people cheaters
and springfield aquatics will put up some huge relays with Lloyd, Brinck Maurer, and Mcfall being on them. They will put up some pretty good times
How about that relay? They still cheated...
and Maurer... swam fast, but y, ignorant mo fo. Nice state records in finals, did I see a 1:49.mid IM and 49low back?. have fun at the big DII school, I don't think he could handle DI either.
How about the 400 free relay? Rockhurst put up a solid time. Anyone know what Maurer split on the end for Kickapoo? I wish they could have been closer, I would have loved to see the showdown between Margs and Maurer.
Yeah Right... Jaguar Lover November 25, 2008 at 12:50pm
are you saying that the blue springs coaches don't have a club feeding them experienced kids like rockhurst and kickapoo? the bs coaches run Team Dolphin! Please don't act like blue springs is at a disadvantage because the fast kids from all over the state also swim club. of course they do. bs is taken care of in that category just like all the other big schools in stl, spfld and kc. that doesn't mean the high school coaches aren't doing a good job.
good programs attract move-ins. always have and always will. unfortunately, a private school is more attractive because you don't have to uproot your family and buy a new house to move in. Rockhurst might simply be better than blue springs right now because the housing market is suffering. know what I'm sayin? it is harder to sell your house this year... and rockhurst transfers don't really need to. if my kid swam club in kc and was at a high school that didn't have a team, guess where i would transfer to? no matter how good the bs coaches are, it would be easier to pay tuition than to take a loss selling my house.
and btw, thanks for doing the math, WOW. a lot of us were thinking the same thing. I think Springfield Aquatics is going to put on a show in the relays at the pro-am and sectionals.
Seriously - that was a big ouch to bones. Hand, Foot and Mouth is tough to get past in his defense. I do agree that BS is full of BS. We all know why the boys transferred, but it also leveled the playing field with ROCK. but at the same time, if BS would worry more about themselves instead of ROCK, it would be interesting to see what they could do.
Since when are the suits cheating? The caps were cheating too right? Quit drinking the Kool - Aid man. Brinck and Maurer were the only ones there all season long? McFall, Waggoner, Bach, Dennis, Snow boys, Lloyd, Doss - I am pretty sure I saw their names on directathletics all year long.
By the way, who is that O'Dell kid and what club does he swim for? Where did he come from? Springfield sucks - 5 teams in the top 20 isn't too bad. And yes, are Reynolds (SPA) and Collins (MSA) are doing a great job with club swimming here in Spfd? YES. But as you know, it takes a coach who cares and creates an environment to have a winning team.
Alright, hey Purp08, are you stupid or something? I know who you are and you're full of it! First of all, why do you insist on being so y all the time? You think you're so good because you did well in high school swimming and made it big time DI in Northern regions where I know your skinny ass will freeze. Get some muscles, suck it up, and be a man! oh yeah, big man being so good at swimming, huh? how'd your senior year go in your individual events? That's what I thought
And second of all, what kind of mischief are you making up about the ""transfers"". yeah, that's right, I quotationed your quotationed transfers. Because I don't believe any of that. Jesse dealt with going to rock while his dad was coaching at blue springs for one year, so obviously he could deal with it some more. He just wanted to get the taste of gold from the springs, that really worked out well after the transfer...
and now second mentioned transfer... that Burns guy. A shootout? really? move to a safer neighborhood? I'll believe that one when 43 ducks fly out my booty hole and vomit out sunshine. How convenient he found a good academic area where all his friends were and a great swim coach. yeah right, I say sure he can move there, but he shouldn't have been allowed to swim.
and oh yeah, Springfield sucks.
Jauguar you are sorely mistaken if you think that the kids on my team could have achieved anything near the sucess we saw without Jason Hite. No matter how good your club coach is you will lose your training over a 3 month high school season, unless you have a good coach. And as far as us not going as fast as we did without LZR's I have to disagree once again. The work that we put in for three months day in and day out is what enabled us to go that fast.
HOLD UP! Stop your in about springfield winning, the reason all those kids went so fast is because the fact they had suits that made them cheat. even the KC kids wore them, but still all those kids came out of no where except for mauer and brinck. Everyone from springfield and rockhurst schools are good because of there club coaches. People from blue springs are good because of there high school coach. SO STOP YOUR IN! The springs takes unknown swimmers and makes them into solid swimmers, with the help of the upper classmen and leadership! I didnt go there but all my friends swam for blue springs so i would know.
Interesting comments all the way across. Wrongagain you might just be worng again. Put Maurer in the back against who from KC - Benson (spfd up by 1 second)? Put O'Dell or Lloyd in the breast vs who from KC - Stanley (spfd still up by 1 sec, maybe more). Put McFall vs White in the fly - still up by 1 sec. Put Brinck vs Margritier in the free - who wins? Maurer wins it in the back & KC just cant come back. The 2 free relay - Maurer, Brinck, Lloyd and McFall - you have 20.7, 21.0, 20.7 and 21.4 Maurer - flat start. you go 1:22. Take off for Maurer since he went his 21.4 a month ago. You have a good race I think. Margritier, White, Benson, Deegan - add theirs up it is 1:22 high. The 400 free is 45.5, 44.6, 45.6, 47.0 - with relay exchanges you are 3:01. KC is White, Marg, Deegan and Benson is 3:03.5 with 1.5 off for relay exchanges. Looks like I would take Spfd. But then again, I am a Spfd dad that likes numbers. I have done the All Star line up because I think it is to bad that Kickapoo did what they did this year without anyone but their own (did have a foreign exchange student though). And, Spfd is getting their swims from an area 1/4th the size.
On another note, I wonder why their is so much bitterness from the athletes. Are you starting this or is this on example of your coaches? I notice the Spfd coaches get along and cheer for each other. I saw Coach Whytlaw (Glendale) and Shepard (Central) all cheering for Kickapoo this year. And Coach Hite cheering for their kids. Why isn't there the same atmosphere in KC?
Ozarkian...you are high. The times tell a different story. take White and Margratier from Rockhurst, Deegan from park Hill and Weber from marshall...KC wins the Medley. 200 free relay isn't close. Maybe the 400 relay but I think KC still wins.
Good swimmers from Springfield, though. Also, if you factor in the KC boys from the KS side it is a romp.
Previous Record, That relay was composed of four guys; Matt Burns, Jeff Patterson, Jesse Shalley, and Zach Bolin. The "transfers" that you are referring to was I guess Matt Burns and Jesse Shalley. Jesse came from Rock because he just didn't really like it there. He didn't like the coach and he wasn't happy with the overall school. Plus, his brother John was going to Blue Springs and his Dad was the coach of springs so I'm assuming that since the two schools were such huge rivals he didn't want to cause a big deal in the house between him, his brother, and his dad. Going to Blue Springs just made things easier. Burns, came from Raytown because his parents wanted to live in a safer environment. I mean one day Burns was coming home from practice and he was aloud down his street because there was a shoot out going in front of his house! I don't know about you, but that would sure scare me out of that neighborhood. They thought Blue Springs was the best because not only was it safer, but the school had a way better academic program then Raytown and for those of you who know Matt he's a genius so he wanted to graduate from a good academic school. And it didn't hurt that all of his friends lived in blue springs too. Including his two best ones. Jeff and Zach were always at blue springs so they should never be an issue anyway. Also, the coaching at blue springs is what made them better swimmers. None of the four were anywhere close to as good as they are now before joining the wildcats.
SWIM, as a matter of fact I do know quite an amount about Pete. Considering I use to swim on the Blazers for 8 years.... I know how much he hates high school swimming. That's why, I've heard, that swimmers in the past decided to quit Rock after their freshman year and not swim for their sopre season. That and the fact that they said that they hated the "horrible coaching" that they received, but the next year, the same year that the duel competition rule was passed (ironically), those two swimmers decided to come back to that same "horrible coaching" and swim for Rock again. Now why would they want to leave the great coaching on the blazers for the bad coaching on Rock? Maybe it has something to do with this new rule? hmmm..... And now why is Pete alright with his swimmers swimming for high school if he never gets to coach them? He never was before this rule was passed....
I'll take the Springfield boys over any combination of Kansas City boys. You can pick an All-Star team from KC and see how they match up in any relay against the boys from Springfield (Maurer, Brinck, Lloyd, McFall)! Too bad all the teams from Springfield actually honor the rules about High School geographic borders. Add Brinck and Lloyd to the Kickapoo team and Rockhurst would have been a distant 2nd.
It's strange that you would bring up blue springs old record time of 3:07 in here. If I remember correctly (and I do) Blue Springs was not nearly as good back in 2002-2004 era, and then suddenly had swimmers transferring from Raytown, Rockhurst, and other schools and became a powerhouse, but I suppose thats not cheating because all of their families probably just decided to move into Blue Springs district at the same time.
Is recruiting LEGAL in Kansas? It doesn't matter. I was recruited by two different Blue Valley coaches and I live in the SM East area....never heard a word from Rock. There is no way to police this...and you can go to any BV school simply by making an application.
You obviously know nothing about the Blazers either. P. Malone hates high school swimming and coaches...he will not allow an elite swimmer to practice Blazers and swim high school. In addition, Rockhurst does not allow its swimmers to swim or compete club during the season. As far as the number of required practices at Rockhurst, that's simple....ALL OF THEM.
Rockhurst has had a great run the last five years and should be OK for another 2-3...beyond that, who knows...this stuff all cycles.
Oh mr. sad face, I think you might be my secret lover.
and you guys are missing the true points of arguing here, we're not trying to argue listing oh so many facts to back our beliefs. The purpose is to make claims with no evidence whatsoever and stick to your guns.
Not only does Rockhurst cheat, I heard they are secretly penguins, sneaky little mo fo's. You may be fast the in water, but good luck flying you worthless flightless birds!
Oh and I heard another rumor about the Blue Springians, I hear they have a secret ritual they do where they touch each others' nipples, and by doing so, they can read each others' minds. I said it, so I believe it.
Hey :-(, Blue Springs swimmers are all trash? How many "real" rock swimmers made it to a big D 1 school in swimming? And, if you can even think of any, they must be REAL swimmers. Not Blazers disguised in Blue and White.... Also, that swim was a good swim by rock at the end of the meet. They did take Springs record by almost two and a half seconds, with LZRs.... I wonder what the Springs relay could of gone with those suits? I mean, before this year, Blue Springs was the only team in Missouri history to ever break 3:10. The next closest team was Rock the same year they went 3:08. Rock cried after that relay.... ;-)
Swim, I don't know where you got your information, but it, and has never been legal for Kansas public high schools to recruit. It's not legal for any public high school that I am aware of. Don't get me wrong, I don't have a problem with everyone on the Rockhurst scoring team living in Kansas. I just have always had a itching question about all of them. Would all of them still swim if that dual competition rule was never passed a few years ago? Or would all the Blazers just stay and chose to train with club? The rule states that you can train/compete for your club team during your high school season as long as you make all of the required high school practices. How many practices a week is rock "required" to make?
To all you whiners...you obviously know nothing about KC high schools...particularly Kansas side high schools. Blue Valley schools in Johnson county can and do recruit...you can go to any school you like. Why would any swimmer want to swim at Rockhurst...they train in an old, ratty YMCA pool, they are completely invisible in a football/soccer dominated school, they compete against tougher schools so the odds of an individual state championship are long (only 3 in the last 10 years) and they NEVER get to swim at home...always in Stl. for the championship. MAYBE the reason they go to school at Rockhurst is that they want the Jesuit experience, maybe the academics, or maybe, like me, it is the closest school to where I live.
None of us are going to make a living at this sport unless we decide to coach. But if you think it is unfair that Rockhurst has Kansas swimmers then I woul guess you believe somehow Kansas swimmers are superior athletes to Missouri swimmers...don't tell that to the other eight schools from the west side that finished in the top ten. Morons
YouStoleMyRecord i'll join you in swimming with the ten and unders at the next club meet, maybe i'll be able to win something for once... oh only horrible swimmers come from Blue Springs. they are all trash... ;-)
Hence....cheaters. ;-)
but don't worry, I was gonna hit up the next club meet and enter myself with the 10 and unders and knock out some national records.
all colleges can recruit. only private highschools can recruit not public. almost all of rocks swimmers that are good live in kansas and if they didnt go there they would be going to school in kansas for all different schools
Men 400 Yards Freestyle Relay (final A)
moral of the story is do some research, get your facts straight, and dont dog or play down team you know nothing about....thanks have a great day!
Also, if you look at their 100 free record I believe it's like a 44.3 or something. I could be wrong though. But based off of that, matt split a 44.6. Add at most a half a second to that matts already less than a second off that record. That doesn't seem like that much time to drop over the next couple of years and so I just don't see it being as motivating as a 43 low would be at a bigger school. I just think he would have a better career if he was motivated more, but maybe he just wants to swim at a smaller, D II school dominating program and a lot of swimmers choose to do that and that's cool with me. As long as he enjoys where he's at that's what's most important
As far as Maurer, Brinck & Lloyd at trials. Yeah - it will happen. Drury has experience getting kids there. Is Drury mainly responsible for getting Maurer, Brinck and McFall and Lloyd to where they are - yes. That is also why Drury is the program it is and wins Nationals every year. And is probably a top 25 program in the US - no matter D - I, II or III.
and springfield aquatics will put up some huge relays with Lloyd, Brinck Maurer, and Mcfall being on them. They will put up some pretty good times
and Maurer... swam fast, but y, ignorant mo fo. Nice state records in finals, did I see a 1:49.mid IM and 49low back?. have fun at the big DII school, I don't think he could handle DI either.
good programs attract move-ins. always have and always will. unfortunately, a private school is more attractive because you don't have to uproot your family and buy a new house to move in. Rockhurst might simply be better than blue springs right now because the housing market is suffering. know what I'm sayin? it is harder to sell your house this year... and rockhurst transfers don't really need to. if my kid swam club in kc and was at a high school that didn't have a team, guess where i would transfer to? no matter how good the bs coaches are, it would be easier to pay tuition than to take a loss selling my house.
and btw, thanks for doing the math, WOW. a lot of us were thinking the same thing. I think Springfield Aquatics is going to put on a show in the relays at the pro-am and sectionals.
Since when are the suits cheating? The caps were cheating too right? Quit drinking the Kool - Aid man. Brinck and Maurer were the only ones there all season long? McFall, Waggoner, Bach, Dennis, Snow boys, Lloyd, Doss - I am pretty sure I saw their names on directathletics all year long.
By the way, who is that O'Dell kid and what club does he swim for? Where did he come from? Springfield sucks - 5 teams in the top 20 isn't too bad. And yes, are Reynolds (SPA) and Collins (MSA) are doing a great job with club swimming here in Spfd? YES. But as you know, it takes a coach who cares and creates an environment to have a winning team.
And second of all, what kind of mischief are you making up about the ""transfers"". yeah, that's right, I quotationed your quotationed transfers. Because I don't believe any of that. Jesse dealt with going to rock while his dad was coaching at blue springs for one year, so obviously he could deal with it some more. He just wanted to get the taste of gold from the springs, that really worked out well after the transfer...
and now second mentioned transfer... that Burns guy. A shootout? really? move to a safer neighborhood? I'll believe that one when 43 ducks fly out my booty hole and vomit out sunshine. How convenient he found a good academic area where all his friends were and a great swim coach. yeah right, I say sure he can move there, but he shouldn't have been allowed to swim.
and oh yeah, Springfield sucks.
On another note, I wonder why their is so much bitterness from the athletes. Are you starting this or is this on example of your coaches? I notice the Spfd coaches get along and cheer for each other. I saw Coach Whytlaw (Glendale) and Shepard (Central) all cheering for Kickapoo this year. And Coach Hite cheering for their kids. Why isn't there the same atmosphere in KC?
Good swimmers from Springfield, though. Also, if you factor in the KC boys from the KS side it is a romp.
You obviously know nothing about the Blazers either. P. Malone hates high school swimming and coaches...he will not allow an elite swimmer to practice Blazers and swim high school. In addition, Rockhurst does not allow its swimmers to swim or compete club during the season. As far as the number of required practices at Rockhurst, that's simple....ALL OF THEM.
Rockhurst has had a great run the last five years and should be OK for another 2-3...beyond that, who knows...this stuff all cycles.
and you guys are missing the true points of arguing here, we're not trying to argue listing oh so many facts to back our beliefs. The purpose is to make claims with no evidence whatsoever and stick to your guns.
Not only does Rockhurst cheat, I heard they are secretly penguins, sneaky little mo fo's. You may be fast the in water, but good luck flying you worthless flightless birds!
Oh and I heard another rumor about the Blue Springians, I hear they have a secret ritual they do where they touch each others' nipples, and by doing so, they can read each others' minds. I said it, so I believe it.
None of us are going to make a living at this sport unless we decide to coach. But if you think it is unfair that Rockhurst has Kansas swimmers then I woul guess you believe somehow Kansas swimmers are superior athletes to Missouri swimmers...don't tell that to the other eight schools from the west side that finished in the top ten. Morons
but don't worry, I was gonna hit up the next club meet and enter myself with the 10 and unders and knock out some national records.